Interview

Ram Vilas Paswan, Union Minister, Chemicals and Fertilizers, and Steel; Member of Parliament, Lok Jan Shakti Party (LJSP) interviewed by Vijay Sanghvi, journalist; Chief of Bureau, Gujarat Mitra.

 

How do you look at the seat-sharing formula in Bihar with the Rashtriya Janata Dal (RJD)?

The seat-sharing arrangement with the RJD was the most logical thing to strengthen secular forces and keep communal forces at bay. It was the need of the hour. By not joining the UPA alliance in Bihar in the last assembly elections, we allowed the NDA to come to power. This time we shall fight the NDA unitedly and win. I am confident that this combination will wipe out the NDA in the coming elections.

 

There is talk of a Dalit prime minister to head the new government. Do you think this is likely?

Yes, there is talk but at the moment all this talk is far-fetched. As far as the UPA is concerned, Manmohan Singh will be the prime minister. The Congress has already declared so. The possibility of anyone else heading the new government would arise only in the event of the Congress returning to Parliament with less than 120 seats. If the party’s strength in the Lok Sabha exceeds 130-135 seats, in all probability Manmohan Singh will be prime minister. Yes, if the possibility of another option does come up, it is my firm view that a Dalit should get an opportunity to lead from the top.

 

It seems Mayawati has positioned herself to fill this role. Would she be able to get the required consensus?

Only Mayawati and her party leaders are talking about it. Have you heard any other Third Front leader backing her candidature? And the reason they are not doing so is that all the Third Front leaders are aspirants for prime ministership themselves – Jayalalithaa, Deve Gowda and Chandrababu Naidu. Is there any party leader in the Third Front who is not in the PM’s race? This is all talk. The ground reality is different. To emerge as a consensus candidate, one needs across-the-board support from within that alliance. But in this Third Front there are only leaders, no followers. So where is the consensus?

 

What do you think will be the essential criteria for the ideal PM candidate, if a non-Congress/non-BJP option is to be considered?

As I said earlier, the PM’s post is not vacant. But if a situation arises that a non-Congress option has to be considered, then clearly, the opportunity must go to a Dalit candidate.

Within that choice, the ideal candidate would have to be one who has wide acceptance across the alliance and enjoys grassroots popularity rather than someone who only pays lip service to secularism or to the poor and the Dalits. This should also be a person who understands and can maintain the coalition dynamics. People accept only those leaders whose actions are perceived as dealing with real issues that affect people rather than mouthing slogans of convenience.

Also, the nation will never accept a person with a tainted record as its prime minister. An impeccable and clean track record of public life and governance is an important consideration.

 

If the opportunity to lead as prime minister comes your way, would you accept it?

If it comes to that, why not. I am more experienced and better equipped to be the Prime Minister of India than most others. If representing the Dalits in all honesty and sincerity is the criteria, my track record and broadbased support from within the community speaks for itself.

There is not a single charge of corruption against me in all my years in public life. Besides, I have been a member of every Union cabinet since 1996 and have served in some of the most important ministries at the Centre.

At the same time, commitment to national ideals is also a principle that one must stand by. I have not hesitated to give up the post when I felt that national ideals were being trampled upon; I did so in 2002.

But having said that let me categorically state that all this talk of an alternative candidate, at this moment, is speculative; it finally depends on the real outcome on the ground.

 

You have been a part of the NDA cabinet and later the UPA government. Do you think this gives you better cross-party support in the likelihood of a consensus choice emerging?

Yes, I have been part of the NDA and it was probably the biggest mistake of my political life. There is no ideological meeting ground. When I joined hands with NDA it was because of Vajpayee ji. I was convinced of his leadership and felt that the Mandir issue was over and done with. But after Atal ji, they continued to harp on Hindutva instead of development, even when it proved to be their nemesis the last time around. The NDA has already begun to unravel. The only leader in the BJP is Advani ji but the rest of them are trying to undercut each other. Bhairon Singh Shekhawat is publicly going against the party line and Kalyan Singh has left the party. Now Jaitley is upset with other party leaders. They are pulling in different directions. There is no question of my joining the NDA even if the post of prime minister is offered to me.

Yes, consensus is important. It is important that the alliance partners that eventually form the government have confidence in the person who leads it, someone with proven credentials able to practice the coalition dharma.

 

What are your views on the Third Front? Do you see this as a credible option going into the elections?

What is the Third Front? It is a ragtag group of leaders who would not have anything to do with each other if not for this cover of a so-called Third Front. The Left parties are confined only to West Bengal and Kerala and even there they have problems. As for the rest, Deve Gowda or Chandrababu Naidu, Jayalalithaa or even Mayawati, where are the numbers? I do not see any possibility of them coming to power without UPA support. And that scenario is quite unlikely.